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Comments on: Neo-Confederate hooey, November 22 edition https://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064 Bringing obscurity into focus Thu, 11 Apr 2019 15:39:26 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=5.0.22 By: Richard Thomas https://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064&cpage=1#comment-45686 Fri, 20 Apr 2012 10:21:59 +0000 http://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064#comment-45686 Describing Wirz as “heroic” is a classic example of black and white thinking with a lot of whitewashing thrown in for good measure.

Were Northern POW camps atrocious? In many instances, yes. Do the victors get to hypocritically punish the losers? Hell yes.

Does any of that change the fact that Wirz was a war criminal (even by mid-19th Century standards ), and unfortunately for him, a war criminal on the losing side? NO. If such an offer was made to him, does his rejection of it mitigate his actions. HELL NO.

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By: Guy https://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064&cpage=1#comment-45494 Tue, 17 Jan 2012 11:41:33 +0000 http://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064#comment-45494 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_prison_ships_%28New_York%29

Anyone appalled by the cruelty of Andersonville may be interested in reading this quick wrap-up. In retrospect, Andersonville was a walk in the park compared to being placed on an intensely crowded ship with no supplies, no guards, cannibalism for survival, and mob rule. This was how “gentlemen” treated prisoners. The black flag of “No Quarter” used for centuries is another example. Some folks may consider this note an attempt to justify cruelty, but quite to the opposite, rather than to focus on the ill will of man, it adds the greatest of honor to the memories of those who volunteered to fight regardless of the knowing that these cruelties could be inflicted on them if captured. Men still fought against the armies flying the black flag with full knowledge, just as black soldiers and their officers in our Civil War. There is more to courage, honor, and valor than standing up to the enemy on the field of battle. One fella has it totally right. We can never judge history by present standards. We must immerse ourselves in the total picture of the day while forcing ourselves to forget the proceedings since in order to make judgements. Rather than to judge, I just thank God that these, the bravest of men, who fought the enemy armed only with the will to survive, so that we today we may sit back in our comforts and find their treatment appalling.

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By: Dennis https://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064&cpage=1#comment-45493 Tue, 17 Jan 2012 10:39:53 +0000 http://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064#comment-45493 No question that sometimes the winners get less “justice” than the losers. That does not make criminals on the losing side less guilty. Crimes were still committed at Andersonville.

Regards,
Dennis

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By: Jon Wallace https://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064&cpage=1#comment-45492 Thu, 12 Jan 2012 15:12:30 +0000 http://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064#comment-45492 I was home this morning and poking around and the History Channels documentary on Camp Douglas in Chicago was on. Near the end of the show the issue of Henry Wirz and his problems versus Colonel Sweet and his treatment of prisoners was raised. Backing up what I said previously, Colonel Sweet ended the war with a commendation for a job well done, Henry Wirz ended the war at the end of a rope. The point was made that at Andersonville, guards suffered nearly the same fate as the prisoners, lack of resources causing hunger, death and disease. At Camp Douglas, resources in abundance were willfully and knowingly withheld from the prisoners causing equal if not worse conditions.

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By: Dennis https://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064&cpage=1#comment-45466 Mon, 26 Dec 2011 11:21:45 +0000 http://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064#comment-45466 OK, I didn’t read you that way. No divergence on what is a crime between us. You stating that who is and isn’t a war criminal is murky is confusing given the above.

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By: Jon Wallace https://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064&cpage=1#comment-45465 Sat, 24 Dec 2011 17:04:51 +0000 http://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064#comment-45465 Or in other words. Exactly what I said.

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By: Dennis https://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064&cpage=1#comment-45464 Sat, 24 Dec 2011 09:35:36 +0000 http://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064#comment-45464 I don’t see anything murky about who is or isn’t a war criminal. I do however see levels of war crimes. One is state sanctioned and the other personal.

What happens to prisoners in camps or at the direction of a commanding officer is state sanctioned. Acts by individuals, while heinous are not in that category.

I see nothing in your statements or mine that provides mitigating circumstances for the acts of any of those mentioned.

Regards,
Dennis

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By: Jon Wallace https://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064&cpage=1#comment-45460 Fri, 23 Dec 2011 13:34:33 +0000 http://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064#comment-45460 We did prosecute the Japanese, and executions were conducted. It just didnt receive the same kind of press and then subsequent history writing that the Nuremburg trials received.

The topic of who is and who aint a war criminal is very murky. (Im going strictly on recollection here) Wasn’t it Custer who hung like 7 (and shot one execution style) of Mosby’s men upon capture?

There are many stories from DDAY, and Viet nam and everywhere else within our own military experience of GI’s executing prisoners because they were too much trouble to handle properly. It goes back to my previous comment above of “the victors naming the war criminals”

It seems to me that the handling of POW’s for any army at any time seems like an inconvenience at best. Throw in a generalized lack of resources (read:food) on the part of that army and you have a situation ready made for an “Andersonville”

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By: Paul LaCroix https://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064&cpage=1#comment-45440 Tue, 13 Dec 2011 13:04:10 +0000 http://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064#comment-45440 Damion, what you’re saying should then be applied to WWII, we had trials for the Germans because of what they did to the Jews but yet we let the Japanese off the hook. What you suggest in your comments, if applied to WWII, is that we shouldn’t have prosecuted the Germans since the Japanase didn’t get prosecuted for what they did to the Chinese and to Allied POWs.

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By: David Navarre https://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064&cpage=1#comment-45439 Tue, 13 Dec 2011 03:43:39 +0000 http://civilwarcavalry.com/?p=3064#comment-45439 I’m with Dennis on this one, Damion. We should condemn all those who committed criminal neglect or worse in regard to prisoners, not give Wirz a free pass because others were given a free pass (or reward) for their crimes.

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